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Author Topic: ***Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol***  (Read 26222 times)

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #30 on: March 20, 2014, 09:49:27 PM »

Pretty sure yohimbe is the plant and yohimbine is the hcl version sold as a fat loss/energy/libido supplement.

I've used it and noticed nothing. Waste of money, stay away.
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mayhem99

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #31 on: March 20, 2014, 10:11:52 PM »

Hate the stuff, made me shake and feel like absolute shit the whole day after taking one. Never, ever again!

I have the same problem but it takes a few weeks to really make me feel like shit.  the shaking thing I got used to kinda figured it was part of it.  I am giving it a shot with clen starting sunday using what roon told me for dosing and see if I can handle it and it still makes me feel like crap. 
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ranson89

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #32 on: March 20, 2014, 10:15:24 PM »

Pretty sure yohimbe is the plant and yohimbine is the hcl version sold as a fat loss/energy/libido supplement.
Yohimbe is the tree.
Yohimbine is an indole alkaloid found in the bark of the tree.
Yohimbine HCL is a standardised hydrochloride form of yohimbine

Quote
I've used it incorrectly and noticed nothing.
^quote fixed.
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ranson89

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #33 on: March 20, 2014, 10:17:09 PM »

Hate the stuff, made me shake and feel like absolute shit the whole day after taking one. Never, ever again!

I have the same problem but it takes a few weeks to really make me feel like shit.  the shaking thing I got used to kinda figured it was part of it.  I am giving it a shot with clen starting sunday using what roon told me for dosing and see if I can handle it and it still makes me feel like crap.

When you say it makes you feel shit, what do you mean? What symptoms are you getting and at what dose? Also were you using other stims at the same time?
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mayhem99

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #34 on: March 21, 2014, 12:47:57 AM »

I was 160lbs using @ max 15mg worked my way up of 2 weeks roughly (I would need to check my logs to be sure) using roughly 400mg a day caffeine 

Drained of energy lethargic pretty much   
High bp
Heavy heart beat
HIGHLY irritable


The weird part is i was good with it till I hit my max dose of 15mg and then it was just not doing anything but making me feel worse I tried to back off the dose and it didn't really help.  I know caffeine will do the same things but I was well under my tolerance to that so I kinda just blamed the yohimbine gave is shot 2 other times and it was around week two right as I was getting up to the recommend dose I would feel like crap.  EXCEPT in oxyelite pro which has it and that stuff is my friend of friends for a OTC fat burner next to EPH and has me thinking I just ran it up to high and burned my self out not sure.

I know yohimbine will increase anxiety not really sure if that was it since I am not one the gets that. 
 
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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #35 on: March 21, 2014, 04:22:30 AM »

I was 160lbs using @ max 15mg worked my way up of 2 weeks roughly (I would need to check my logs to be sure) using roughly 400mg a day caffeine 

Drained of energy lethargic pretty much   
High bp
Heavy heart beat
HIGHLY irritable


The weird part is i was good with it till I hit my max dose of 15mg and then it was just not doing anything but making me feel worse I tried to back off the dose and it didn't really help.  I know caffeine will do the same things but I was well under my tolerance to that so I kinda just blamed the yohimbine gave is shot 2 other times and it was around week two right as I was getting up to the recommend dose I would feel like crap.  EXCEPT in oxyelite pro which has it and that stuff is my friend of friends for a OTC fat burner next to EPH and has me thinking I just ran it up to high and burned my self out not sure.

I know yohimbine will increase anxiety not really sure if that was it since I am not one the gets that.

OK, in that case definitely keep the dose 12.5mg or lower and be very careful introducing clen as well!

All the symptoms you have listed point towards a build up of norepinephrine (this is metabolised by A2 receptors). I'm guessing you were also using IF when you used it before?
There are a couple of things you can do to modulate the effect a bit. Mainly minimizing intake of tyrosine (found largely in cheese and other dairy) and keeping glucose intake down and as far away from yohimbine dosing as possible.

Also BTW I checked out Oxyelite Pro - it contains Yohimbe bark, not Yohimbine HCL :)
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mayhem99

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #36 on: March 21, 2014, 05:19:20 AM »

Looked at my bottle of oep never noticed the bark extract.  That explains all since what I have now is hcl.  Also yes I pretty much just adopted IF full time now at least that is the plan.  I like it works for me.  Now zero dairy will be a problem but I can cut it back and there will be a good 6 hours before I eat any thing after my clen yohimbie dose.  That should be good I hope.  Only need about 5 maybe 10 more pounds then it's back to tren bulk for me.  Roon you must research way more then me and that it's saying a some thing.  I going to start my dosing Friday nit Saturday will post on how it goes you been really helpful. 
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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #37 on: March 21, 2014, 08:12:13 AM »

consider that:
taking a lot of caffeine with yohimbine forces you to take a lower dose of yoh
not good..you want just a little bit of caffeine and a lot of yoh
30-35mg yoh 50mg caff i get no anxiety sides just physical sides when im actually doing cardio.  heartrate rises very fast and is very slow to go down once carido finishes
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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #38 on: March 21, 2014, 02:21:45 PM »

dang I always wrote yohimbine off as a bs supplement that companies marketed for fat people. after reading this thread and looking into how it actually works I kinda wanna try it. I learned about the alpha receptors in exercise physiology so it makes sense to me.

Does anybody know anything about Rauwolscine? roon? haha
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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #39 on: March 21, 2014, 02:39:23 PM »

I just read that yohimbine taken with food might add to insulin release from pancreatic cells. But sense yohimbine only adds to the insulin release induced from glucose, yohimbine will not induce insulin realease in a fasted state.

EDIT: ok it just dawned on me why this happens. there are alpha receptors on the pancreas and an agonist binds to those alpha receptors it signals the pancreas to not secrete insulin. yoh is an antagonist on alpha receptors so it blocks the alpha receptors from telling the pancreas to stop releasing insulin. Exercise science as a major has its perks haha

Which is good because we don?t want insulin when trying to burn fat. But maybe you could take yoh with your meals to get a bigger insulin spike? (probably not a cost effective way to increase insulin)

Adrenoceptor antagonists, but not guanethidine, reduce glucopenia-induced glucagon secretion from perfused rat pancreas.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8861456

Involvement of a central nervous pathway in yohimbine-induced insulin secretion.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2566496

Plasma catecholamine levels and lipid mobilization induced by yohimbine
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1885256

Alpha 2-antagonist compounds and lipid mobilization
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2906290
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ranson89

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #40 on: March 21, 2014, 06:12:31 PM »

Looked at my bottle of oep never noticed the bark extract.  That explains all since what I have now is hcl.  Also yes I pretty much just adopted IF full time now at least that is the plan.  I like it works for me.  Now zero dairy will be a problem but I can cut it back and there will be a good 6 hours before I eat any thing after my clen yohimbie dose.  That should be good I hope.  Only need about 5 maybe 10 more pounds then it's back to tren bulk for me.  Roon you must research way more then me and that it's saying a some thing.  I going to start my dosing Friday nit Saturday will post on how it goes you been really helpful.
You don't need zero dairy, the main issue is cheese. Chances are there won't be much effect anyway but it might be a good idea to drop cheese if you are eating any. :)
The IF guess is because fasting periods can increase norepinephrine levels. I would guess that you experienced the side effects when the Yohimbine was blocking enough receptors to reach a 'threshold' level of norepinephrine - raising BP and heart rate and giving you the irritability sides. The lethargy is a side effect based on the stimulant properties of Caffeine + Yohimbine. This gives you the feeling of energy thus likely increasing activity levels despite the actual energy sources not existing.

dang I always wrote yohimbine off as a bs supplement that companies marketed for fat people. after reading this thread and looking into how it actually works I kinda wanna try it. I learned about the alpha receptors in exercise physiology so it makes sense to me.
Haha, it's one of those things that has to be used properly and with proper expectations. Supp companies take the known effects and exaggerate them. Also they tend to use Yohimbe bark not Yohimbine HCL, in the same way as they use Ephedra extract not Ephedrine HCL.

Quote
Does anybody know anything about Rauwolscine? roon? haha
Who, me?     ...Maybe  :P

I just read that yohimbine taken with food might add to insulin release from pancreatic cells. But sense yohimbine only adds to the insulin release induced from glucose, yohimbine will not induce insulin realease in a fasted state.

EDIT: ok it just dawned on me why this happens. there are alpha receptors on the pancreas and an agonist binds to those alpha receptors it signals the pancreas to not secrete insulin. yoh is an antagonist on alpha receptors so it blocks the alpha receptors from telling the pancreas to stop releasing insulin. Exercise science as a major has its perks haha
Lol, I've only posted that it's an Alpha-2 antagonist 3 or 4 times...     ;D

Quote
Which is good because we don?t want insulin when trying to burn fat. But maybe you could take yoh with your meals to get a bigger insulin spike? (probably not a cost effective way to increase insulin)
Yep that's the point! Fasting + Yohimbine = fat loss.

Sadly you haven't fully read the studies on insulin release, it won't increase insulin spike. This only occurs in conjunction with a Beta antagonist.

By not blocking the Beta receptors, this will theoretically increase insulin secretion, however homeostatic feedback will prevent an increased spike and the addition of glucose stimulates the pancreatic delt cells to secrete somatostatin which overrides both and nullifies the insulin secretion.

Quote
Adrenoceptor antagonists, but not guanethidine, reduce glucopenia-induced glucagon secretion from perfused rat pancreas.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8861456

Involvement of a central nervous pathway in yohimbine-induced insulin secretion.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2566496

Plasma catecholamine levels and lipid mobilization induced by yohimbine
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1885256

Alpha 2-antagonist compounds and lipid mobilization
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2906290
Good studies though!
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ranson89

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #41 on: March 21, 2014, 06:48:55 PM »

Does anybody know anything about Rauwolscine? roon? haha
I haven't forgotten this!

Rauwolscine is another of the alkaloids found in yohimbe bark, it is molecularly identical to Yohimbine but the arrangement is different. It has almost identical effects but to a lesser degree, it's also less selective in antagonism of alpha-2 vs. alpha-1 receptors.

Yohimbine selectivity: 45 (alpha2: alpha1)
Rauwolscine selectivity: 3 (alpha2: alpha1)

Basically a less effective version :)
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Boarding

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #42 on: March 21, 2014, 07:30:43 PM »

Pretty sure yohimbe is the plant and yohimbine is the hcl version sold as a fat loss/energy/libido supplement.

I've used it and noticed nothing. Waste of money, stay away.

Please, enlighten me?
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Focused

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #43 on: March 21, 2014, 10:41:52 PM »

Pretty sure yohimbe is the plant and yohimbine is the hcl version sold as a fat loss/energy/libido supplement.

I've used it and noticed nothing. Waste of money, stay away.

Please, enlighten me?

maybe you used bark not HCL or maybe your supplement company lied about the label...

or maybe you were not using it in a fasted state?

Roon pretty much answered everything about yoh in this thread already...
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Focused

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #44 on: March 21, 2014, 10:43:06 PM »

Sadly you haven't fully read the studies on insulin release, it won't increase insulin spike. This only occurs in conjunction with a Beta antagonist.

By not blocking the Beta receptors, this will theoretically increase insulin secretion, however homeostatic feedback will prevent an increased spike and the addition of glucose stimulates the pancreatic delt cells to secrete somatostatin which overrides both and nullifies the insulin secretion.

are you a scientist? lol you really know your stuff. Thanks for the info I am finding it helpful.

one of the reasons I was confused is because alpha cells have beta receptors and beta cells have alpha receptors and I got mixed up!
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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #45 on: March 21, 2014, 10:45:34 PM »

In case anybody is interested  I picked up 2 grams of powder yoh HCL for stupid cheap on amazon a few hours ago.

But I have a milligram scale already...
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ranson89

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #46 on: March 22, 2014, 12:03:20 AM »

Pretty sure yohimbe is the plant and yohimbine is the hcl version sold as a fat loss/energy/libido supplement.

I've used it and noticed nothing. Waste of money, stay away.

Please, enlighten me?

I assume this is aimed at my 'edit' of your post? :)
Perhaps if you read the thread you may reach some enlightenment, I've already posted a few things...

However, without knowing your dosage, timings, other supps, length of use etc. it's quite difficult to see why you didn't experience any results.
It's also pretty pointless to post a blanket statement on a compound such as you have without any kind of proof, reasoning or evidence other than that you personally did not get results. And without posting your use that in itself is a worthless argument.


are you a scientist? lol you really know your stuff. Thanks for the info I am finding it helpful.

one of the reasons I was confused is because alpha cells have beta receptors and beta cells have alpha receptors and I got mixed up!
Lol no problem bro! :)

You mean that alpha cells, alpha1 receptors, alpha2a receptors, alpha2b receptors, alpha2c receptors, beta cells, beta1 receptors and beta 2 receptors can be confusing?  ;D
Damn science, it's all greek to me  :P
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mayhem99

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #47 on: March 22, 2014, 12:17:53 AM »

So I did some digging on my own just because I was interested and Roon you have got it point on my friend.  I think now that I am going to be dosing a little better I will be able to use yohimbine hcl with my clen and not feel like crap.  Also made me happy that I don't have to cut dairy out completely and its mostly cheese which I don't eat I am a milk person next to egg whites its one of my favorite liquid protein sources.

Little up date started clen yohimbine hcl (primaforce)  20mcg clen with 2.5mg yohimbine and I honestly feel really good little more shaky then normal but good none the less.   
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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #48 on: March 22, 2014, 12:28:38 AM »

roon12 awesome postings fella, can you give a breakdown of an exact Yohimbine HCL protocol you'd recommend?
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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #49 on: March 22, 2014, 04:44:15 AM »

I felt I was cooking/over heating when I was taking 15mg 2x daily. Also the head aches were bad and just all around for terrible. I pitched the rest of the bottle out. .
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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #50 on: March 22, 2014, 02:30:00 PM »

I felt I was cooking/over heating when I was taking 15mg 2x daily. Also the head aches were bad and just all around for terrible. I pitched the rest of the bottle out. .


FOR SAFETY


if yoh sides ever get too bad take some simple sugars, this will deactivate yoh and you will very quickly be released from all its bad sides ie. within 5 min

you will hurt your fat loss, but sometimes you need to escape the side effects quickly

im at 150mcg t3 for past 5 days 30mg yoh 50mg caff fasted..went for a 1.5 hour bike ride but had to buy a mcdonalds milkshake to counter the yoh towards the end...heartrate was too bad and my energy had plummeted unnaturally.  milkshake got the heartrate under control very quick and all the other physical sides also left.  felt the yoh sides melt away...it is extremely easy to know when 30mg yoh is active in my body and when it is deactive
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***Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol***
« Reply #51 on: March 22, 2014, 06:05:18 PM »

Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol
Roon12

What is Yohimbine?
Yohimbine is an indole alkaloid found in the bark of the Corynanthe yohimbe tree. The standardised form discussed here is the hydrochloride salt form Yohimbine HCL. It acts primarily by inhibiting the action of Alpha-2 Adrenergic Receptors, exhibiting stimulant and lipolytic effects.
Due to acting on Alpha receptors it has the ability to preferentially target ?stubborn fat? where high concentrations of these receptors are found. In males this is typically the lower abdominal area and low back while in females it is predominantly the hip and thigh areas.

Is this protocol for me?
The goal of this protocol is to remove the last bits of stubborn fat, therefore a degree of leanness is required. These fatty deposits are the last to go so as a rough guide decent abdominal visibility and vascularity are indicators this may be for you.

Introduction.
There are four main components to the fat loss protocol, below is a brief summary of each:
1) Yohimbine HCL: Hopefully this is self-explanatory!
2) Stimulant of Choice: potentiates the effects of the Yohimbine, several variations will be described below
3) Fasting periods: The effects of Yohimbine are negated by the presence of insulin in the bloodstream, therefore it should be used in the fasted state for maximum efficacy
4) Cardio: Low intensity fasted cardio following yohimbine ingestion will act synergistically to enhance the fat burning effects.

Choosing a Stimulant.
There are several stimulants that can be used in conjunction with yohimbine to enhance the effects, each with pros and cons. Since the effects will be amplified it is important to build up the dose steadily and to use only one stimulant alongside yohimbine.

 - Caffeine: This is the best choice for a first time user. It?s cheap, readily available, has few sides on its own and is well tolerated by most.
 - Clenbuterol: A potent thermogenic in its own right, when used in conjunction with yohimbine there are several beneficial effects. Yohimbine will extend the active life of a single clen dose by a few hours as well as delaying the receptor down regulation induced by clen, allowing it to be run continuously for 5-6 weeks.
 - Ephedrine: This is the combination most likely to lead to side effects. Due to the synergistic action, the effects of this combo (both positive and negative) are much greater than the sum of each separately so use this with extreme caution and dose conservatively.

Dosing:
 - Yohimbine: Work up to a max dose of 0.2mg per kilogram (~0.1mg/lb) of bodyweight. Start at half of your max dose and adjust as necessary.
 - Stimulants (choose one!)
   - Caffeine: 200mg should be plenty for most people (note that coffee is NOT an acceptable substitute here)
   - Clenbuterol: Maximum dosage is a ratio of 1mg Yohimbine : 8mcg Clen
    - Ephedrine: Max dose 25mg Ephedrine. The amount of Yohimbine may need to be decreased.

Cardio:
Low intensity cardio is done 30-45 minutes after taking the Yohimbine to allow it time to enter the system. Due to the combined stimulant effects, yohimbine can cause a falsely elevated heart rate; i.e. exertion that would normally raise HR to 140bpm may actually raise HR to 150-160bpm, thus any form of HIIT or weight training is not recommended. I would suggest incline walking as a good option but any form is fine.
The cardio is not absolutely necessary to the efficacy of this method but is highly recommended and will result in greater fat burn than the two parts separately. If cardio is not performed then the fasted period should be extended as described below to allow normal daily activity to expend calories.

Timing:
This method is to be used first thing in the morning, while fasted as insulin is at its lowest here. It can be done every day if needed, with or without cardio. If using every day I would suggest 1-2 days of no cardio per week (at least to start).

 - Immediately on waking take the full dose of Yohimbine and your Stimulant
 - 30-45 minutes later perform 20-60 minutes of Low Intensity Cardio
 - Post-cardio, ideally continue the fasted period for 2-3 hours, however a small protein/fat only meal can be consumed 45 mins post-cardio if necessary
 - Eat as normal for the rest of the day

 - If no cardio is performed then the fasted period should last for 3-4 hours post ingestion of Yohimbine, with regular eating resumed from then on. If absolutely necessary a small protein/fat meal can be consumed at least 2 hours after taking Yohimbine.

Notes:
This method can cause problems in some due to the synergy of the compounds used and the false heart rate induced by Yohimbine. For this reason it is advisable to build up the doses slowly, starting with Yohimbine + Caffeine and ensuring the cardio is kept moderate. The cardio here should also replace any other cardio done that day to prevent excessive fatigue. On a similar note, leg training should ideally be performed on a ?cardio? day using this method but later on in the afternoon/evening. If you train early then leg sessions should be the day after.
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ranson89

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Re: ***Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol***
« Reply #52 on: March 22, 2014, 06:06:01 PM »

Original thread with comments and science:

http://www.gh15.org/forum/index.php?topic=28439.0
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ranson89

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Re: Yohimbine
« Reply #53 on: March 22, 2014, 06:08:14 PM »

roon12 awesome postings fella, can you give a breakdown of an exact Yohimbine HCL protocol you'd recommend?
I've been meaning to write some methods for various compounds so as you asked nicely  :P

Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol:

http://www.gh15.org/forum/index.php?topic=28597.0
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Re: ***Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol***
« Reply #54 on: March 22, 2014, 08:09:25 PM »

how come coffee cant be a substitute for caffeine pills in this case?
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mayhem99

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Re: ***Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol***
« Reply #55 on: March 22, 2014, 08:19:50 PM »

Nice write up Roon thanks for this.  ;D
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Re: ***Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol***
« Reply #56 on: March 22, 2014, 10:39:35 PM »

Awesome! I've got plenty of Yohimbine HCL on hand and am starting up your protocol this Morning. Thank you for writing this up, greatly appreciated. You know your Yohimbine, that's for sure!
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Re: ***Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol***
« Reply #57 on: March 22, 2014, 10:55:00 PM »

how come coffee cant be a substitute for caffeine pills in this case?
Several reasons. First inaccurate dosing vs. pills. But more importantly the point of the caffeine is to get it into the system quickly along with the Yohimbine for the synergistic effect, for this pills are more effective than coffee.
Also there is a greater insulin response to coffee vs. pure caffeine - lowering the efficacy of yohimbine.


Nice write up Roon thanks for this.  ;D
Awesome! I've got plenty of Yohimbine HCL on hand and am starting up your protocol this Morning. Thank you for writing this up, greatly appreciated. You know your Yohimbine, that's for sure!
Thanks fellas, post up how you get on with it! (BTW I have a few more to come on different compounds  ;))
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Re: ***Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol***
« Reply #58 on: March 22, 2014, 11:18:58 PM »

roon12, what do you think of herbal appetite suppressants? I feel they work really well, if I take too much of some like Garcinia or Caralluma it gets to the point where I get nauseous around food, they can be powerful stuff. I think it would be awesome if you started a thread on herbal dietary aids, fat burners, diet enhancers, etc... Did you see my thread on Pyruvate by the way? I'm using 6g of that daily right now as well.
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Re: ***Yohimbine Fat Loss Protocol***
« Reply #59 on: March 22, 2014, 11:21:51 PM »

How do you feel about Synephrine as the stimulant? I've got both Yoh. HCL and Synephrine HCL raw powder off of Amazon (Still need a scale to measure accurately), but I've noticed it seems to work in the thermogenic sense. I used a starting dose of 15mg Synephrine and 5mg of Yohimbine and working up from there.

Adapted this from another forum where someone suggested a stack of Synephrine, Green Tea Extract (form of EGCG), and chromium.
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